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[-Kanrabat-]

And here's CvC's review for Crosshairs. Important to note is that his copy is missing the spoiler, which we know the figure will include based on prior renders and in-hand pics from Hasbro.

Crosshairs definitely isn't as much of a win as Hot Rod, but the molded detail is pretty impressive.

Well, this "kind-of" highlights my point, although not exactly. The copy in this "review" (sic) isn't the same as the proposed/actual retail version, for better or for worse.

Your anti PvP "activism is very, very annoying.

But ironically, you're very, very right on that point.

[william-james88]

The live action movie Crosshairs does not have a design that translates well to toys. His whole design gimmick is that the car body becomes a flowing trench coat. The previous attempts (both in AOE and TLK) went all in on the trenchcoat design, with the idea of it wrapping around his sides as it does in the film. There were clearly some sacrifices to make that happen with innacuracies in the top half of the toy. The new Studio Series version aims more to look like the sleek character model and drops the trenchcoat gimmick for the most part. The toy attempts to keep the look when facing dead on but does not retain the dual functonality of the car body as previous toys have. That does of course liberate the designers in other aspects as you will see below when comparing to the previous version. People seem torn on this with there being pros and cons to both attempts at bringing this character to toy form. You'll let us know where you land.

The images come from a review by PrimevsPrime. All shots below are of the robot mode because the car mode in the video is incomplete and we would rather not confuse you with it. You can see the original review here.

[primalxconvoy]

More peachy tips from Seibertron, eh?

Anyway, saying the character "does not have a design that translates well to toys" is inaccurate. A more competent use of lexis would be "hasn't translated well (so far)", if one can accept it's more to do with subjective opinion than established fact. Still, the OP tried, I suppose, so there's that?

[SpaceEagle]

Poor ol' Crosshairs, has enough kibble to rival that of Arcee.
I do really like the upper body and colours of the Studio Series version, but the trenchcoat looks nicer on the previous toy. I might still pick it up if there's better ways to handle the kibble (official or not, à la Sentinel Prime's cape) because I still otherwise like the rest of it.

[blackeyedprime]

Old figure looks better to me, that side view alone is enough to ensure it stays on the store pegs even at discount for me. The big hinges for the flaps is another. The head/face definitely looks more baynus for whatever that is worth.


Realistically if the vehicle mode is incomplete, then so is the bot mode. Might be a wait and see for better photos but I'm liking the colors and definition better on the old figure anyhoos.

[noctorro]

Well the paint and face look better. But man those bots have horrible designs of TF 4. They are just big dudes in space armor who can teleport in a vehicle mode.

If the robot mode doesn't resemble a vehicle at all, then you know what it is and can only be. A shellformer. Galvatron practically is a shellformer because his robot mode is just a sci fi space robot, not a Transformer.

I think I'll continue to hunt for the first version of Crosshairs since it has some feely value.

[SpaceEagle]

Well the paint and face look better. But man those bots have horrible designs of TF 4. They are just big dudes in space armor who can teleport in a vehicle mode.

If the robot mode doesn't resemble a vehicle at all, then you know what it is and can only be. A shellformer. Galvatron practically is a shellformer because his robot mode is just a sci fi space robot, not a Transformer.

I think I'll continue to hunt for the first version of Crosshairs since it has some feely value.

I definitely agree, 4 & 5's designs are amongst my least favourite because they don't even look like robots that are able transform into cars, just robots that happen to 'animorph' into a car. The toys did somewhat help me with liking the designs - but that's due to them actually embracing the car parts for some (I do like Drift's Bugatti toy, as an example, even if it's quite kibbly.)

[primalxconvoy]

Well the paint and face look better. But man those bots have horrible designs of TF 4. They are just big dudes in space armor who can teleport in a vehicle mode.

If the robot mode doesn't resemble a vehicle at all, then you know what it is and can only be. A shellformer. Galvatron practically is a shellformer because his robot mode is just a sci fi space robot, not a Transformer.

I think I'll continue to hunt for the first version of Crosshairs since it has some feely value.

I definitely agree, 4 & 5's designs are amongst my least favourite because they don't even look like robots that are able transform into cars, just robots that happen to 'animorph' into a car. The toys did somewhat help me with liking the designs - but that's due to them actually embracing the car parts for some (I do like Drift's Bugatti toy, as an example, even if it's quite kibbly.)

It took 3P/KO versions of Bayverse characters for me to appreciate some of their aesthetic qualities, such as this upcoming, triple-changing version of Drift. It's great, although the copter mode isn't great.

(Source: - https://showzstore.com/metagate-haiku-drift_p4108.html )

[SpaceEagle]

Well the paint and face look better. But man those bots have horrible designs of TF 4. They are just big dudes in space armor who can teleport in a vehicle mode.

If the robot mode doesn't resemble a vehicle at all, then you know what it is and can only be. A shellformer. Galvatron practically is a shellformer because his robot mode is just a sci fi space robot, not a Transformer.

I think I'll continue to hunt for the first version of Crosshairs since it has some feely value.

I definitely agree, 4 & 5's designs are amongst my least favourite because they don't even look like robots that are able transform into cars, just robots that happen to 'animorph' into a car. The toys did somewhat help me with liking the designs - but that's due to them actually embracing the car parts for some (I do like Drift's Bugatti toy, as an example, even if it's quite kibbly.)

It took 3P/KO versions of Bayverse characters for me to appreciate some of their aesthetic qualities, such as this upcoming, triple-changing version of Drift. It's great, although the copter mode isn't great.

dea7ffb1ce.jpg

(Source: - https://showzstore.com/metagate-haiku-drift_p4108.html )

I will admit the Bayverse designs really helped toy companies with pushing the limits of engineering. I mean heck, HasTak have at least done some impressive stuff for their price point, but unofficial figures are absolutely slaying it with being able to make the figures as accurate as possible that can still transform convert between forms.

[Emerje]

As always, if this is not the official version, it would be prudent to wait for actual retail versions being reviewed by legit YouTubers before we jump to any conclusions regarding any possible faults or defects in this mold. For all we know, the retail versions might differ considerably to ones by those giving us peegey tips, however "helpful" they may seem. This might even be true if the unboxed versions are BETTER than the originals, and we get our hopes up.

Don't these usually come right off the assembly line? Unless they have Hasbro's serial numbers printed directly on them they're probably final products. Do you have any examples of reviewed figures being different from the retail release (aside from blemishes and broken parts)?

Emerje

With 3P products, whenever they're reviewed, they're often accompanied by disclosures that they're pre-production samples (even if they're close to the final product or end up being exactly the same as the final product). This is how more honest YouTubers give us a look at such toys, while also giving us enough info to make more informed decisions prior to purchasing. In some cases, they even state that the companies are aware of certain faults and will (or already have) rectified them.

From personal experience, I've found some of the faults mentioned by those that have watched such unripe product reviews, don't always turn up in the Takara-Tomy versions, so I'm a little sceptical. That's why I usually only watch legit YouTube videos, as any faults mentioned in them might be more widespread.

I'm more interested in the facts, rather than "reviews" akin to fortune telling:

I'm talking about real Transformers, not bootleg garbage.

Emerje

[primalxconvoy]

I'm talking about real Transformers, not bootleg garbage.

Emerje

1/ 3P TFs aren't "bootleg garbage".
2/ I already mentioned the differences between "reviews" of (possibly stolen) pre-production samples and later official Takara-Tomy releases.

[ZeroWolf]

I'm talking about real Transformers, not bootleg garbage.

Emerje

1/ 3P TFs aren't "bootleg garbage".
2/ I already mentioned the differences between "reviews" of (possibly stolen) pre-production samples and later official Takara-Tomy releases.

They are technically bootlegs though, with the IP theft and all, which I think Hasbro hates more then the early sample reviewers.

[-Kanrabat-]

They are technically bootlegs though, with the IP theft and all, which I think Hasbro hates more then the early sample reviewers.

It would be an "I.P theft" if they used the official symbols and names. So unless they are straight KOs like what's plaguing G1 and MP, I see most if not all 3P toys as "fan art".

And so often, the "fan art" one-up the officials by a large margin. Just look at anything Unique Toys are making.

[ZeroWolf]

They are technically bootlegs though, with the IP theft and all, which I think Hasbro hates more then the early sample reviewers.

It would be an "I.P theft" if they used the official symbols and names. So unless they are straight KOs like what's plaguing G1 and MP, I see most if not all 3P toys as "fan art".

And so often, the "fan art" one-up the officials by a large margin. Just look at anything Unique Toys are making.

I would only compare them if they're in the same price range as 3p have their fair share of advantages over hasbro. I would be far happier if more 3rd parties made their own IP, then Hasbro would see some real competition (something they've not had in a long while)

[-Kanrabat-]

I would only compare them if they're in the same price range as 3p have their fair share of advantages over hasbro. I would be far happier if more 3rd parties made their own IP, then Hasbro would see some real competition (something they've not had in a long while)

"Same price range" is a bit hard to compare when things are produced by smaller companies in smaller quantities. So if I make any comparisons, I go with the same "category" if that makes any senses. Like "MP style" with other MP, "generations style" with Generations.

As for original IP, there's tons of 3P companies who started with "fan art" and then made their own things with their own original designs that have ZERO "hommages" to any Transformers. Unfortunately, they don't have the power of a large corporation like Hasbro or Bandai to be real competitors.

The "MPM" that HASTAK won't make and the 100% original designs. Those are the 3P toys I prefer to collect.

[ZeroWolf]

As for original IP, there's tons of 3P companies who started with "fan art" and then made their own things with their own original designs that have ZERO "hommages" to any Transformers. Unfortunately, they don't have the power of a large corporation like Hasbro or Bandai to be real competitors.

Those are the ones I love, I've seen some great designs in that field.

[william-james88]

I'm talking about real Transformers, not bootleg garbage.

Emerje

1/ 3P TFs aren't "bootleg garbage".

They aren't bootlegs, you're right, but they are unlicenced figures, stealing likeness owned by Hasbro (or Paramount). The fact that they come from a place which has more lax copyright laws cements that fact, we wouldn't get these from American companies. They are thiefs too, but you seem to be cool with them which makes you look like a major hypocrite (I don,t know who you re as a person, I am just stating how you come across in board interactions). I don't care what twisted and complex logic you write up, that is what you look like: a hypocrite which no one can take seriously, hence why I ignored you for years. However due to several complaints of lack of modding, I have "un-igored you" to remove posts that go against our rules, as you have noticed. You can't criticize or antagonize staff on baords. If you have issues, you know where to send a message. I am making the warnings very clear here so that you can know why you are banned in the future.

Moving on (the following is addressed to everyone), while my opinions on the design differences were in the article, I've since seen a lot of people reffer to the trenchcoat as a cape. And I agree, this does look more like a cape with extra flaps in the front of the robot and the fact that people are calling this a cape is a pretty good sign that there's been some failure in bringing the character's design to toy form.

However, it does look more sleek like in the film and he indeed looks more accurate when looking at the character head on, so still unsure about whether I will be picking him up or not.

It would be an "I.P theft" if they used the official symbols and names. So unless they are straight KOs like what's plaguing G1 and MP, I see most if not all 3P toys as "fan art".

Likeness is also included in IP theft. Some 3p, like the ones for the movie characters, would most definitely get a cease and desist if the toys came from an american based company. As I wrote above, 3p toys coming from a place that has very different laws in terms of copyright infringement is not a coincidence.

[SpaceEagle]

I'd say unofficial figures would fall under IP theft because many of them just use designs from G1, IDW, or Bayverse specifically to give fans an alternative option than the ones HasTak are offering us. (Which I guess also steals buyers of the real products too, y'know.) I s'pose you could even throw in the IP theft of the car models as well when it comes to G1 or Bayverse, since they're likewise meant to replicate the model without any actual licensing (HasTak are guilty of this themselves now and then.)

I do think the most interesting of non-HasTak TFs are definitely the more original ones, while still for the most part snagging the overall likeness of a character, it's honestly much more appealing to see them try something unique! (Like, seriously, did we really need all those 'toon accurate Menasors?)

I do, of course, see the appeal of unofficial figures if they offer something that otherwise really can't be obtained, like some of those IDW designs that HasTak will probably never do and/or MP-adjacent figures that likewise have car brands that will probably never give the license to 'war machines' ever again.

[Hellscream9999]

Man that crosshairs figure is looking really rough, glad for everyone that's excited for it though. I feel like crosshairs in particular would have needed a leader class budget to be done well - which we all know will never happen, and likely wouldn't even yield an enjoyable toy, which is a shame as I love the concept of the design.

[SpaceEagle]

Man that crosshairs figure is looking really rough, glad for everyone that's excited for it though. I feel like crosshairs in particular would have needed a leader class budget to be done well - which we all know will never happen, and likely wouldn't even yield an enjoyable toy, which is a shame as I love the concept of the design.

Haha yeah, would need some real budget finagling to get it just right only to probably not even be worth the dough or effort!
Still, I think what we've gotten (so far) have at least been alright for the price they go at.

[Hellscream9999]

Man that crosshairs figure is looking really rough, glad for everyone that's excited for it though. I feel like crosshairs in particular would have needed a leader class budget to be done well - which we all know will never happen, and likely wouldn't even yield an enjoyable toy, which is a shame as I love the concept of the design.

Haha yeah, would need some real budget finagling to get it just right only to probably not even be worth the dough or effort!
Still, I think what we've gotten (so far) have at least been alright for the price they go at.

I feel like they should have just reworked the original figure, the rubber flaps worked better for me

[SpaceEagle]

Man that crosshairs figure is looking really rough, glad for everyone that's excited for it though. I feel like crosshairs in particular would have needed a leader class budget to be done well - which we all know will never happen, and likely wouldn't even yield an enjoyable toy, which is a shame as I love the concept of the design.

Haha yeah, would need some real budget finagling to get it just right only to probably not even be worth the dough or effort!
Still, I think what we've gotten (so far) have at least been alright for the price they go at.

I feel like they should have just reworked the original figure, the rubber flaps worked better for me

Maybe they might pull a SS86 Arcee with that!

[EvasionModeBumblebee]

In case you were wondering what the hole in Galvatron's chest is really for!

My paint work isn't finished on Galvatron yet, so the final version will be much more complete than what you see in the picture xD

[primalxconvoy]

I'm talking about real Transformers, not bootleg garbage.

Emerje

1/ 3P TFs aren't "bootleg garbage".
2/ I already mentioned the differences between "reviews" of (possibly stolen) pre-production samples and later official Takara-Tomy releases.

They are technically bootlegs though, with the IP theft and all, which I think Hasbro hates more then the early sample reviewers.

1/ 3P TFs are not technicality bootlegs.
2/ Please cite evidence that "Hasbro hates (them) more than early sample reviews).

As you seem to lack knowledge about this subject, feel free to read the main page at this link:

- https://www.allspark.com/forums/threads ... hread.134/

There, you will find relevant links to the various definitions, facts, etc regarding this aspect of the TF fandom.

(It's mainly about "KO" TFs, which are what others usually refer to as "bootlegs", but the legal definitions and terminology also can refer to unofficial 3P products too.)

You're most welcome to post your opinions there, or even at Seibertron's dedicated thread to the same subject:

- third-party-and-knock-off-transformers-news-t109857s375.php

Hope this helps you to learn more about this aspect of TF collecting.

They aren't bootlegs, you're right, but they are unlicenced figures, stealing likeness owned by Hasbro (or Paramount). The fact that they come from a place which has more lax copyright laws cements that fact, we wouldn't get these from American companies. They are thiefs (sic) too,

Likeness is also included in IP theft. Some 3p, like the ones for the movie characters, would most definitely get a cease and desist if the toys came from an american based company. As I wrote above, 3p toys coming from a place that has very different laws in terms of copyright infringement is not a coincidence.

Incorrect, as I've stated, refer to the link I've provided and you'll see most, if not all of the points you've stated are simply not true. Again, I hope you are able to learn more about this aspect of TFs.

[SpaceEagle]

I'm talking about real Transformers, not bootleg garbage.

Emerje

1/ 3P TFs aren't "bootleg garbage".
2/ I already mentioned the differences between "reviews" of (possibly stolen) pre-production samples and later official Takara-Tomy releases.

They are technically bootlegs though, with the IP theft and all, which I think Hasbro hates more then the early sample reviewers.

1/ 3P TFs are not technicality bootlegs.
2/ Please cite evidence that "Hasbro hates (them) more than early sample reviews).

As you seem to lack knowledge about this subject, feel free to read the main page at this link:

- https://www.allspark.com/forums/threads ... hread.134/

There, you will find relevant links to the various definitions, facts, etc regarding this aspect of the TF fandom.

(It's mainly about "KO" TFs, which are what others usually refer to as "bootlegs", but the legal definitions and terminology also can refer to unofficial 3P products too.)

You're most welcome to post your opinions there, or even at Seibertron's dedicated thread to the same subject:

- third-party-and-knock-off-transformers-news-t109857s375.php

Hope this helps you to learn more about this aspect of TF collecting.

I just assumed the basic logic on why HasTak would dislike unofficial figures more is because, well, "Hey, they're buying someone else's stuff based on our stuff rather than actually buying our stuff itself!"
(Of course, buying an early sample from some factory worker still means someone didn't buy it from HasTak either, but I am not going to pretend to be an expert on how manufacturing costs and/or the gravy of profit that comes from stores buying products from HasTak to sell rather than the consumer buying it from the store.)

Especially since with early sample reviews still generating some hype and interest in HasTak's products vs unofficial figures usually making people go "Ah geez, why the heck aren't the official figures like this?" (Which, I mean...considering the bang for the buck you get with stuff like MP-44...I can see why an unofficial fig' does a whole lot better.)
And thus HasTak would [probably] prefer it if people buy official stuff instead.

Ah, gotta love those multibillion dollar megacorporations!